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Dog: (November 05, 2009 6:46am)

That should be a USPAP and an HVCC violation. If you don't get the value, they send elsewhere.

PG: (November 03, 2009 8:59pm)

Adding to the comments regarding shopping deals/comps. Some of the AMC's here in Colorado are now requiring the appraiser to do a desktop appraisal for a fee up front. If the client moves forward with a full appraisal, they'll do everything in their power to ensure you get the order but your new order fee is reduced by the desktop that you did.....HMMM???? This is a growing issue and now some companies are saying that if you don't agree to do this then they won't put you on their list of approved appraisers. Thank you Mr. Government for all of your support and protecting all of us here to attempt keeping things right.

Valuequestor: (November 03, 2009 7:00pm)

CA HiD: So they order a cheapie to see if it will work then have you upgrade to full appraisal for a bump in the fee. If it doesn't work out they're only out for the Drive-by fee. Maybe you should call FHA and see what they think about this practice. They probably don't care. Its a cheap move but it makes sense from the AMC's point of view.

GODLIKE: (November 03, 2009 5:54pm)

BobtheBanker while it might be OK for you to give a referral fee it is illegal for the Realtor to accept and he/she can lose their license. You are doing the Realtor a disservice by even offering it.

CAHighDesertAppraiser: (November 03, 2009 4:46pm)

Valuequestor...its an AMC asking for the appraisal on "behalf" of their client...i have the case #. However since I requested an upgrade to a full appraisal 1004 they suddenly decided to re-assign to another appraiser....Whatever!

Valuequestor: (November 03, 2009 4:29pm)

Let me rephrase: Its nothing FHA would accept. Make the requesting company pay up front.

Valuequestor: (November 03, 2009 4:24pm)

Hey HiDesert, Totally BOGUS. Sounds like they are fishing for a clean sheet or a value before assigning a case number.

CAHighDesertAppraiser: (November 03, 2009 4:18pm)

Appraisers...any of you ever do a "drive-by" FHA purchase appraisal on a new construction tract home??? with a 1004mc of course.......can you even do this on FHA purchases?

Valuequestor: (November 03, 2009 4:10pm)

Any California Appraisers out there have a comment about REAA. I was looking at the rosters of the 3 existing chapters. They are relatively new but have numbers that certainly are competing with the established and relatively inaffective appraisal orgs. Maybe this group could be a vehicle for organizing the appraisers of the Golden State?? Anybody have any experience with them?

20YR LO: (November 03, 2009 3:21pm)

Jeff & other Brokers, just to clarify.There are Mortg. Brokers, Mortg. Bankers and then there are loan reps that work in banks. Just because you are a Mortg. Banker does not meen you are an order taker sitting in a branch. 20 years as a Mortg. Banker and have never taken a loan ap in a bank bracnh. I worked for National City which was aquired by PNC for 11 years, they do not have a bank branch west of the Mississippi, I' in CA. No refferals from the bank as they have no name recognition in Ca. Beforer that I worked for AccuBanc Texas based no banks here. Mortgage Bankers work for clients the same way brokers do, knowledge, integrity and compettive rates, where you get the idea that you can always get the client a better deal is just inaccurate. The Bank I currently work with has rates that are very competitive. Just last month I beat the realtors in house broker by 1/2% on her sons purchase. Go figure, oh and we do have personality too.

BobtheBanker: (November 03, 2009 2:57pm)

We just deposit the money in the realtor's account as a "new client referal" to the bank because that is what it is a new client. This is not a resppa violation. Banks are free to govern themselves on how we generate a client base.

SoCal Mortgage Broker: (November 03, 2009 2:55pm)

Jeff: I appreciated your comment. I have been in Mortgage Banking and Brokering. I have always had to keep up with the rules & regs. Having been through several HUD audits, I learned it was the only way to keep HUD approval. A HUD auditor once told me that they wouldn't go after Countrywide because they were so big they didn't care what HUD said. It's to bad the small shops have to pay the price for those that are "to big to fail"

Valuequestor: (November 03, 2009 2:42pm)

Too many rules and regs. The systems need simplification and enforcement. How easy is that? Evidently nearly impossible. Once upon a time in this country the mantra was free enterprise and competition in order to provide citizens with choice and quality of services and goods. When all of the stores are Wal-muts and all the banks are "Too Big to Fail". We can change their names to the " The State Store" and "The State Bank". Competition will be at an end, you will accept what you are given and we will have lost the dream of our founding fathers.

Jeff: (November 03, 2009 2:36pm)

Hello fine professionals: I've enjoyed your opinions, links, and general guidance. It appears that most of you desire to make a positive impact in our industry and likely your communities. These standards are very consistent with my ideals and those we set forth in my company. To make a quick note: In my community and state, brokers are the most educated, heavily scrutinized, community minded, professionals who originate mortgages. It's not even close when you evaluate the talent of the originators in our Indiana community, just 30 minutes outside of Chicago. Furthermore it is unfortunate that it only takes a little personality and even less skill or knowledge to be a banker. I always say the mortgage originating bankers are the best salesman in existence to sell the exact same mortgage at a much higher price; with all due respect there are good banking folks out there, yet the proportion of top professionals, here, have chosen to operate as a broker; in the best interest of the client

LeadDog: (November 03, 2009 2:06pm)

Bob, "banks" are not exempt from RESPA. Max referral fee allowed by law is $25. Jeez, all these people worried about brokers when it's the bankers who don't know squat and are abusing all the rules.

SoCal Mortgage Broker: (November 03, 2009 1:58pm)

BobtheBanker: Didn't know banks were exempt from RESPA. I doubt that they are.

BobtheBanker: (November 03, 2009 1:46pm)

I have been giving my realtors a minimum $100 per referal for years. Besides being clients of the bank and can apply these referrals as "new client referals" in our system, I know for a fact from my bank manager that we do not have to follow the rules that are in place for the "brokers" out there - we are exempt.

TXRealtor: (November 03, 2009 1:35pm)

No, there is no place that indicates cash to close. Which is why most smart, reputable brokers will rename the current GFE form to something like "Mortgage Shopping Tool" and provide that in addition to a new GFE so that they can continue to use it. A couple other things - it is my understanding that it is ILLEGAL for a mortgage broker to provide a GFE to anyone other than the borrower, so the Realtor cannot assist the borrower unless the client knows to bring it to their Realtor and/or the Realtor knows to ask for it. How exactly, is that helping the consumer? By the way, did I mention that there is no signature page on the new HUD-1? All of this (and the posts below) means that it is going to take longer, possibly kill transactions, create more liability for the industry professional, regardless of your job description, and be clear as mud to the consumer whom these changes are enacted to protect. Does this sound familiar to anyone?

???: (November 03, 2009 1:17pm)

TXRealtor Did you see anyplace on the new GFE that indicates the cash to close? I only see closing costs and prepaids

TXRealtor: (November 03, 2009 1:09pm)

Other changes: As mentioned, lender fees may not be changed unless there are "changed circumstances" (CC), which are narrowly defined to 4 main categories. Lack of space to provide here, but CC are NOT:changes to the property address, value estimate, loan amount sought, credit report if done prior to GFE, or market fluctuations. Also, seller paid costs are not shown, so a buyer could come away from receiving a GFE thinking he needs to bring $15k tothe table, when he might really only need $7k. This could deter buyers from moving forward. FHA and VA financed insurances are shown as costs, not as part of the loan. Oh, and let me go back, the GFE and the HUD-1 are now tied at the hip - they are like the Doublemint twins now. If there are multiple loans (like on an 80-10-10), there must be multiple GFEs and multiple HUD-1's. Finally, the LO cannot charge fees to the buyer that were not on the GFE! While this is good to protect against bad LO's, good LO's will lose flexibility when necessar

TXRealtor: (November 03, 2009 12:56pm)

Starving: The quick and dirty is, it sucks. The goal was to make the costs more transparent, when it does anything but - itemized costs ARE NOT ALLOWED - all lender fees are rolled up into one number. These fees must also NOT CHANGE through the loan process, so if for example someone decides to change their down payment, the fees (including origination) remain the same. The consumer could either over- or under-pay, depending on the change - either the broker will eat the shortcoming or the consumer will be overcharged. Some unscrupulous brokers, if they end up eating too much due to no fault of their own, might become less motivated to actually process the loan. Also, there is no more PITI - it now is PIMI, with TI as a separate line item which an uneducated consumer or Realtor might miss and fail to understand that a persons payment be several hundred dollars more than expected. Points - not detailed, so there is no way to claim them on your tax return.

cindylou: (November 03, 2009 12:38pm)

Socal Appraisal Gal_ I am in AZ. I have requested a field review and then sent in a dispute on the first one. Cant wait to see what the field rev. comes back at. Once that comes back I will be filing a complaint with the O RE. I hope they really take these seriously.

TabascoJack: (November 03, 2009 12:11pm)

I am learning the same as others. Re Max/ Coldwell Banker/ Keller Williams has questionable agreements where they pay rents in excess to have their deals sent to them. Many just have an office there but the rep is never to be seen. It is a flat out KICK BACK and when is the RESPA going to question it?

Sunny: (November 03, 2009 12:00pm)

Brian and Frank, Can you please put this argument to bed on brokers and bankers. We all know brokers are not going anywhere. It is a stupid argument that just takes up space.

rob-fries with that?: (November 03, 2009 11:54am)

Spank'n the Brok R, I am not sure if you understand the mortgage brokers are small businesses that serve their local communities. How you feel Quicken loans, Lending Tree or a huge bank is able to serve their local market is beyond me. The reason mortgage brokers accounted for more than 50% of closed loans in recent years is that we do it better, faster, cheaper and with a more professional skills than the guy taking orders at the drive through. Sure there were bad brokers, but if you analyze the figures there were a higher number of bank originated loans that went bad than broker originated. Also...HVCC came about because WAMU was pushing values with appraisers...not brokers. Get is straight...and if you have a small business-good luck right back at you!

Spank'n the BROKE R: (November 03, 2009 11:25am)

Ktatom. Mortgage Professional is an OxyMORON. Emphasis on MORON. Besides. YOu slung mud first so sit back and take your beating like good little prostetute. All ribbing aside though, take a look at your business model and ask yourself: If the mtg business model does change so drastically that you can't compete with the banks, Mega Mortgage Originators and other licensed professionals that can originate, WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO? Can you survive on a no YSP, .5% origination fee loan? Or... when requirements to requalify as a broker or costs to maintain status rise, will you survive?

ktatom: (November 03, 2009 11:02am)

Spanknthebroker/Drown'ndabroker (or whatever else you want to hide behind) The reason you "Don't need to", is because you can't! Your Junior High humor is much appreciated but this site is reserved for mortgage professionals.

zeta: (November 03, 2009 10:49am)

'Spank'n the BROKE R:' you're joking right? i'm embarrassed for you with what you wrote; that's called humiliation. Seriously; so you want communism then? it doesn't take 'anything' to sit in a bank and quote the one rate you were told you are allowed to sell 'that day' and if a borrower has 20% down payment with credit scores over 720 - YOU can get them a loan. Woo Hoo. yeah, that takes talent.

Drown'n Da BROKE R: (November 03, 2009 10:48am)

Ktatom. Don't need to. Industry, legislation, consumer demand, media, constant arrests of brokers, NAMB, and ALLLLLLLLLLL the other activity any half awake nim wit can witness going on proves it. Additionally we attend many behind the doors meetings where conversation always ends up with someone saying "WE NEED TO GET RID OF ALL THE BROKERS". There is an OBVIOUS, Undeniable move to making the broker obsolete. If you can't see that then you deserve what you're going to get. A good o'l patooty kick'n.

Starving Appraiser: (November 03, 2009 10:43am)

TX-can you give us a summary on the new HUD-1 statement coming?

TXRealtor: (November 03, 2009 10:41am)

Brian & Frank - PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE start getting the word out on the confusing mess coming that is the new HUD-1 statement. Like everything that comes out of Washington, it is a debacle that is going to make your life more difficult, my life as a Realtor more difficult, and confuse the consumer, not to mention make fraud and excess fees easier to hide from the consumer or the clearly clueless enforcement arms of government. The time to make noise on this is NOW, before the changes go into effect and before we get into the holidays and people stop paying attention to business for the rest of the year. I understand that there are movements afoot to delay or kill HUD's "improvements" - PEOPLE NEED TO CONTACT THEIR REPS TO MAKE SURE THEIR VOICES ARE HEARD NOW, NOT LATER! We can fight this issue more effectively now, rather than trying to roll it back later (see HVCC). I'm really surprised there hasn't been more out about this in the industry!

ktatom: (November 03, 2009 10:36am)

spanknthebroker. Why do you believe that what you are saying is true? Please back it up with fact and not speculation.

Spank'n the BROKE R: (November 03, 2009 10:31am)

Yo. Ktatom, your fear of losing your job has clouded your ability to READ and Comprehend. More evidence why brokers are becoming obsolete. Mega shops like QUICKEN will dominate. PEONS like YOU will wither away. Learn a new phrase, "DO YOU WANT FRIES WITH THAT"? Because that's all you're really qualified to do. I'll make sure I check my drive through bag for straws and napkins though. I hear TAPS playing in the background. A salaried professional with personality who knows the ropes and has no incentive to place a loan other than to ensure the customers future sucess is what will prevail. Bye Bye BROKE R.

Home Counselor: (November 03, 2009 10:21am)

"47 years and referral fees have always been illegal" Not to mention, not so kosher, (ethical) business practice, whether disclosed or not. It still feels muddy...Where's the fiduciary in that?

Appraiser Pete in CA: (November 03, 2009 10:20am)

Socal Appraisal Gal- Where are you located? Are you doing only FHA work or are you getting AMC work? What are you doing to stay afloat?

Socal Appraisal Gal: (November 03, 2009 10:15am)

Opps typo last message was response to Cindylou and Sun Trust Appraisal issue not dindylou..

Socal Appraisal Gal: (November 03, 2009 10:14am)

dindylou which state is your property in. You should always dispute a bad appraisal. I personal dispute them weekly. I provide a review of the original appraisal as well as a second full appraisal and state it is not hvcc compliant. If they are truely vilolations with the first appraisal I turn them into enforcement with the Office of Real Estate appraisers.

Perturbed: (November 03, 2009 10:13am)

I'm sorry. Am I missing something? Why aren't mortgage professionals who knows the reality of the industry helping to write these regs? What's NAMB really doing? Is it only the big banks with the money able to adise these idiots? Where is there more info about who's actually involved in these bills? Can we get ahead of these bill writers?

SoCal Mortgage Broker: (November 03, 2009 10:02am)

Anyone interested in ready the rules prohibiting kickbacks and unearned fees can go to http:/www.hud.gov/offices/hsg/ramh/res/resp2607.cfm. I have been in the mortgage business for 47 years and referral fees have always been illegal.

Starving Appraiser: (November 03, 2009 9:43am)

BF loves Gerbils-that seems to be all you ever say on this post. I was hoping for 1 day without those disgusting references. What's the deal? You seem to be all too familiar with the homo/gerbil practice. Are you homophobic or just homosexual? "NOT THAT THERE'S ANYTHING WRONG WITH THAT", just tired of hearing the same old same old disgusting reference every day. Poor gerbils!!!

Starving Appraiser: (November 03, 2009 9:37am)

DABEARS-as pointed out to me last week, there's no guarantee the "new crew" will be any less corrupt, but if history is the best indicator of the future, it's likely they will be as corrupt, if not more. AND, then we'll be paying them/the new crew lifetime benefits as well. I still say, enforce the laws, weed out the corrupt, in politics & RE industry. Not a fan of the "Kindergarten" mentality where we punish the entire class for the bad behavoir of a few. Deal with the problem child/children and leave the good kids alone. Of course, we'd need to live in "Wal-Green's" perfect world for that to happen in this day and time.

brian tbws: (November 03, 2009 9:27am)

Hi RotGirl, It very well could be a respa violation & we're looking into that right now.

FL-Broker: (November 03, 2009 9:19am)

Al Broker and Fed Up- How is a co-marketing/advertizing agreement for a flat 3000.00 per month with no promise of closings a violation of RESPA. That situation sounds exactly like buying leads, you would be paying for the opportunity to market yourself to realtors in hopes of gaining business. You stated your self that there was no promise of any business and the 3,000.00 was not dependant on whether or not you closed deals. it is he same thing as buying leads.

EG: (November 03, 2009 9:12am)

Break the Banks. Overturn the Government

Starving Appraiser: (November 03, 2009 9:09am)

10/26/2009 NY Post - "Andrew Cuomo has secretly notified Rudy Giuliani that he will run for governor next year, The Post has learned." - I can't vote repub, but will refuse to vote for a dem candidate such as this. Am facing a similar situation in my state...long time popular dem senator is considering alignment w/Joe Loserman on the filibuster issue. >>>Funny thing, when I searched for the Post article, a link to TBWS 08/06/2009 daily was in the list. You guys are getting out there!!!

Referral Zonk: (November 03, 2009 9:04am)

i just funded a deal last week and the HUD showed a big fat referral fee from the escrow agent to the asset manager!!!! is that allowed? Plus, I think we all know that the REO listing agent gives a kick back to the asset manager....it's just not on the HUD.

DABEARS: (November 03, 2009 9:04am)

STARVING APPRAISER, the lifetime benefits they receive is nothing in comparison with the trillions that they bilk us for each and every year. You could pay lifetime benefits down to their great great great grandchildren and we would still save trillions just by slowing down the crooks for a few years. Lifetime benefits are just a silver lining. Their seat is the golden frickin goose.

Evil Genius: (November 03, 2009 8:52am)

100 Characters ain't that much! Finally the rest of my rant and e-mail starting with Freddie Mac:  Freddie Mac was established in 1970. You have had 39 years to get it right and it is broke.  The Department of Energy was created in 1977 to lessen our dependence on foreign oil. It has ballooned to 16,000 employees with a budget of $24 billion a year and we import more oil than ever before. You had 32 years to get it right and it is an abysmal failure. You have FAILED in every "government service" you have shoved down our throats while overspending our tax dollars Finally, once again, we should wipe the slate clean and start from scratch. Thw wheels are in motion. No more Fannie/ Freddie or Government intervention. For more info mortgagebidz@msn.com

Arnold: (November 03, 2009 8:48am)

If Cuomo runs for governor of New York, I will send a check to his Republican opponent. This is coming from life-long Democrat who has only voted for one Republican in 31 years and has never missed an election.

Evil Genius: (November 03, 2009 8:48am)

Continued from previous: Its the bond and derivitives that cause most of the volatiliy. Set the rate and deplete the portfolio. There is a new lender on the horizon that will get away from Government and banks and Fannie/Freddie. Here's the previously mentioned e-mail: It is now official you are ALL corrupt morons: The U.S. Post Service was established in 1775 You have had 234 years to get it right and it is broke. Social Security was established in 1935. You have had 74 years to get it right and it is broke. Fannie Mae was established in 1938. You have had 71 years to get it right and it is broke. War on Poverty started in 1964. You have had 45 years to get it right; $1 trillion of our money is confiscated each year and transferred to "the poor" and they only want more. Medicare and Medicaid were established in 1965.. You have had 44 years to get it right and they are broke. Freddie Mac was established in 1970. You have had 39 years to get it right and it is br

Fed Up: (November 03, 2009 8:47am)

Al Broker, Bank Of America also pays Real Estate office's for a "desk & office space" It's funny how they advertise as the self proclaimed best & honest company when they do kickbacks whether they pay or get paid with realtors, appraisal, credit report, escrow and title companies. Oh don't forget the clean up crew, locksmiths and license contractors for their REO's.

GODLIKE: (November 03, 2009 8:42am)

The poll sure brings home what you were talking about in the video. I sorta scratched my head about who had the 10% requirement and wondered exactly how it affected me that is until I finally noticed the poll du jour.

Evil Genius: (November 03, 2009 8:42am)

I received the following e-mail this morning from someone who is not in our industry. He is in Healthcare. But I found it interesting that both Fannie and Freddie made this list, which will be seen by many eyes on the internet. We really need to stop bitching about this stuff on blogs and actually do something about this out of control yet controlling government. Term linits or just get rid of the career politicians. I don't care how but Boner Franks should not lead anything. Also besides politics, here's an understatement, but banks have too much power and we can begin to undermine them with regards to mortgages. This will take a concerted effort by institutional size investment funds (that don't always like banks, by the way) who will put up funds for the long term for a fair return. Keep these portfolio funds retained and intact with a couple of unique product concepts. Why wouldn't a pension fund want to stabilize a certain portion of their portfolio in a stable mortgage market.

Inflation Nation: (November 03, 2009 8:29am)

Dognponny- you fail to understand the history of Mortgage banking**refer to {ktatom}post for a taste... You believe everything they tell you? Your Big Bad Bank is using you like sheep and your drinking the koolaid. Your an order taker and dont ever forget that and as such your worth less. So you will be paid less and less and less. Your already seeing... I know you are. Have fun doing 50 loans a month. Great Loan officer or Slave to the grind?

Starving Appraiser: (November 03, 2009 8:25am)

Did we all hear last week that Cuomo is making his move to run for NY Gov? OH BOY, want that be stupendous for our industry!!! Like he hasn't been destructive enough as AG. Would love to comment on B Frank, but still can't watch the video...gotta exchange my 7yr old, outdated comcast modem & see if that helps.

GODLIKE: (November 03, 2009 8:15am)

BONO VOX the law I was referring to was federal and would apply to all states. There was just no hoorah when it finally went into effect so I don't know if it was changed or delayed further.

Oh Broker: (November 03, 2009 8:15am)

Frank, here in central Ohio, many of the home builders offer up to 6points concessions if the buyer uses their lender (most use Wells Fargo) but offer no assistance if they don't. What's more, most of them MAKE the buyer apply/get pre-approved with their lender first, regardless of whether they intend to use them or not. Why? So they can dangle the 6points in front of them so it is impossible for another lender to compete.

Ex Phx Realtor: (November 03, 2009 8:13am)

It seems to me that the purpose of Barney Franks bill is to squeeze out the smaller banks leaving less competition for the "too big to fail" banks. Another step toward socialism for this country. Here is another great link for you to see if you are interested http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PMe5dOgbu40. I don't agree with term limits. In my congressional district in AZ we are lucky to have a very hard-working congressman in John Shadegg. He has worked harder than anyone else in attempting to defeat this public option healthcare bill. And he has put together his own plan which is far, far superior to anything the democrats have proposed. I definately want to keep him working for all of us.

Starving Appraiser: (November 03, 2009 8:12am)

WHOLLY KRAP-ites mye gramar & spelin dat reelly suckes dis mournin...gess i beeter have anothre cupp of coofee!!!

Bono Vox: (November 03, 2009 8:09am)

AL Broker - Please report Keller Williams for a RESPA violation. Nineyt sq ft for $3000/month is far above market rent. That's against the law. Keller won't pay any fines or get in trouble, but it's against the law. Maybe you can make one of these appraisers give you kick backs to help pay for it....KIDDING APPRAISERS - KIDDING! Enough with you people, I'm going to go sell some money now. Go forth and prosper -

Starving Appraiser: (November 03, 2009 8:07am)

Ordinary & GHeinze-I previously posted and e-ml msg I rcv'd suggesting this very thing, vote out all the incumbents over the next 3 yrs. MAN, I was called everything but a child of God for that post. But a few good points did come out of it. If we were to do that, every politician (& their spouses)we vote out, would rcv lifetime medical benefits, retirement benefits, etc. at our expense. SO, although it's a revolutionary idea, there's got to be a better way than punishing ourselves/the taxpayers. How about they enforce regulations & weed out the corrupt... wishful thinking I know.

Bono Vox: (November 03, 2009 8:05am)

GODLIKE - Nationally and on a state by state basis, there are laws regarding builders and the incentives to use their lenders. Unfortunately, the language is very slippery, so they always find a way around. Host a fundraiser at your home for your district's state reps and see if you can't buy some time to discuss it!

Bono Vox: (November 03, 2009 8:03am)

KTATOM - Why are you referring to Dogn as a retard? Or course brokers are under pressure. The gov't sees them an unregulated cowboys and the big fellas see them as competition. Call any mortgage bank in your area and ask them who they are recruiting and hiring. In Houston, entire broker shops are closing and making the move to regional and national banks. They generate profit, so it's not a problem at all for the banks to hire more and more folks.

Ordinary American: (November 03, 2009 7:57am)

GHeinze, It's easy just convince everyone every where to vote out the incumbent. In three elections we will turn over Congress and the Senate. We will get Barney and Friends. Term limits is the answer but you know they won't vote for that because it's job security for them. So "We the people", need to act against all incumbents.

Starving Appraiser: (November 03, 2009 7:54am)

General, I agree 100% & consider communications w/HOs & agents part of the customer service I provide to my clients. I'm thankful my clients don't try to explain every little detail of the apprsl as they are not apprsrs, they trust me to do that. I NEVER refuse to talk to someone, but I might limit the communications depending on how contrary they are. And always follow up the discussion w/a call to the client so they know what was sd from my end & don't have to rely on an unhappy HO or agents take on the conversation. As apprsrs, our time and experience is the product we are selling and to be successful, you have to support that with good communication/customer service. I am not an arogant "APPRSL GOD" (not that you implied I am) but know too many that are of that mind set & clients hate that.

GHeinze: (November 03, 2009 7:48am)

Prudential Real Estate is around and strong in this area of SC

Starving Appraiser: (November 03, 2009 7:45am)

Guess I'm in the lucky few that aren't pressured by my clients, not that it hasn't happened in the past, but if the client won't stand behind me & my report, they aren't my client. I've never bowed to pressure, I have reconsidered based on new legit info presented to me. HO issue example, did a 1+ sty sf, @3 yrs old, measured inside upstairs & outside down, HO disputed my SF based on the construction apprsl done from P&Ss, and we know how P&Ss can & do change from the end results. Client ask to me compare my sketch to the orig apprsl sketch and the first thing I pointed out to the client was the orig apprs didn't even have the correct subject address on the grid. My ? was, what house did he apprsr. Once I pointed out that minor to some, but reflective of very poor quality, detail, end of story, never heard another word about it. Client stood behind me & my report, not the orig provided by the HO.

generaljean (appraiser): (November 03, 2009 7:41am)

Starving Appraiser: On very few occasions I have had borrowers submit comps. They don't understand what it is we are trying to do and a polite "I will look at them" is necessary. Sometimes, you can tell them straight up that the comps are "out of the market area" and give a short explanation. We are in NE Mich and are very rural too. Remember, they don't know what the HVCC is. Talked to a Realtor yesterday--she never heard of HVCC or an AMC either, so it goes to show you. Don't let it make you too uptight. Take the info politely and move on.

GHeinze: (November 03, 2009 7:40am)

How do you vote out BArney when you are not in his State?

Starving Appraiser: (November 03, 2009 7:34am)

James, yea that's pressure, but I don't think there's anything you can do about it since a HO is not a RE-related professional, unless of course they are (agent, appraiser, broker, etc.), then you might have a stance. I deal with this all the time as well, hard to decide if it's the HO or the agents that take 1st place in the list of complainers. What I think really sucks, is that a disgruntled, uneducated to the process, HO can file a complaint w/the local board against an appraiser creating all kinds of havoc for that apprsr, yet all we can do is choose rather or not to talk to them. I usually talk to them, once or twice, at my clients request. I don't fear any board action, I know I can support/defend my values, but it sucks none the less.

**IMPORTANT**: (November 03, 2009 7:31am)

I believe that we all agree that something should be done about this in a timely manner. It would be prudent to issue some sort of study that involves complicated, ambiguous graphs and myriad charts drawing some sort of vague, indecisive, yet, somehow conclusive findings that support wherever it is we stand on this issue, but I'm not going to take that specific a stance on the subject. Anyone want to not second it?

GODLIKE: (November 03, 2009 7:25am)

GHEINZE that might explain the reception I had at the area Prudential offices - before they went out of business. I thought Pru closed their doors everywhere.

James the Appraiser: (November 03, 2009 7:24am)

Starving Appraiser - As an appraiser I will ask you, am I under PRESSURE (see comments from before) and how should I handle it? lol

GHeinze: (November 03, 2009 7:22am)

Big companies such as Prudential Real Estate own their own mortgage company and do FHA I thought this was not permissable. ALso(in SOuth Carolina) several memebers on the RE Board are the BIC's of Prudential. How about they tell their agents that there is a $300.00 charge if they don't use their mortgage company(which incidentally is partnered with Wells Fargo) Since they are a bank I guess they are exempt. I don't have the 40 million like they do to usurp the laws.

Starving Appraiser: (November 03, 2009 7:22am)

In case you didn't know, Wal-Mart is already in the RE buz. Here, when they buil a new super center, the out-lots are offered by Wal-Mart Real Estate Company. And now their selling caskets. Guess they want to benefit from the "death of small town America" they created. I admit, I am a WAL-MART HATER, and with cause.

ktatom: (November 03, 2009 7:22am)

Dognbrokers - The degree of your stupidy is profound. The fact is that roughly half of all US mortgages are orginated by broker and sold/serviced by larger banking institutions. Without brokers who is going to orginate all of those loans? The employment cost of obtaining those assets (loans) will put a significant strain on an already frail banking system and at some point it just won't make it worth it. Let's see . . . We borrowed 20 billion from the Federal Government, we're holding billions in shadow inventory, thank God they suspended mark to market are we'd already be shut down, and We need to double our staff to meet demand that's going to bring a worse ROI. By the way retard, that stands for Return On Investment. The fact is that without brokers, you are out of a job.

GODLIKE: (November 03, 2009 7:16am)

FRANK I'll send you details on Ashton Woods this afternoon. They offer to pay the title policy and various upgrades to use their lender but won't on an outside lender. Virtually all the larger builders like KHov, Historymaker, Drees, Pulte, DR Horton, etc., etc. at the very least pay the title policy for an in-house lender but won't for an out of house lender. It was my understanding that was illegal as of about July 2009

GODLIKE: (November 03, 2009 7:11am)

AL Broker I've had several Realtors offer me the same deal with my same response. They've always been replacing someone else who hasn't seemed to "perform up to expectations."

DAG: (November 03, 2009 7:08am)

I had a Reatlor write a contract recently, called me and asked if I had a problem with their office closing the loan. I told her I'd talk to the borrower about it. She replied, "they won't do anything to you if you don't use them". When I asked what that meant, she said, oh, you can use whoever you want, but I have to write it in the contract. This particular Realtor group has Realtors, mortgage company, title company and home owners insurance. One stop shopping, huh. Since Realtors and bankers are self governing, it has been fruitless to fight. I did have the state licensing dept say they would pursue the builder issue, but since builders are not governed by them, I don't see that as going anywhere. BTW when Realtors write junk like that in the contract I never abide. Once I explain to the borrower what they are not looking out for him, it's all good.

Rotgirl: (November 03, 2009 7:07am)

I'm a licensed real estate broker working 100% for the lenders/banks selling REOs.....Frank and Bryan, you've got me VERY curious about the "referral fee" you mentioned being paid to asset managers as a few of the 3rd party management companies that I work with do indeed charge a referral fee that comes out of my commission. I've never been happy with this so if there's a reason WHY this is illegal, I'd sure like to know about it and have ammo to fight them on this. Ciao.....rg

James the Appraiser: (November 03, 2009 7:06am)

Ha, I just had 2 called on Monday from a Home owner in an attempt to point out sales in what he called the area. Is this pressure? I know the homes he talked about,they are just 2 miles from me in this semi-rural area, but not in his area. SO IS THIS PRESSURE I SHOULD REPORT or just smalie and complete my report?

AL Broker: (November 03, 2009 7:01am)

I was approached my a Keller-Williams office and asked if I would like to be their preferred mortgage lender and locate in their new offices. I would get one room with a telephone, speak at their weekly sales meetings, I must be on site and available to their agents. They did say that they could not guarantee any referrals and that they could not make their agents use me. In return for my one room office (about 9x10), my rent would be $3,000!!! What fool would do this? Sounds like they were asking me for a kickback. I already had 1,500 sq. ft. of office space for $1,300 a month. I had another top producing agent from another company whom I had been trying to get business from ask me how I would sweeten her pot. Needless to say, I refused both offers.

carealtor/lender: (November 03, 2009 6:59am)

Anyone who has documented, detailed, horror story about an HVCC senario, please send it to the following representatives at NAR: thutchinson@realtors.org with a cc to ron@phippsrealty.com NAR is doing a "full court press" on Congress to eliminate HVCC. Now is your time to state your case.

KatieFan: (November 03, 2009 6:55am)

ok... I got my 15 seconds of Katie... DUH!!!

leaddogy2k: (November 03, 2009 6:54am)

I know guys like "dognthebroker". He's failed at everything he's tried and the one that stings the most is that, once things got really hard, he was one of the 1st to fail as a broker. He now does very little work for very little pay and needs the "survivor brokers" to fail to validate is inadequacies.

Frank Garay: (November 03, 2009 6:54am)

GODLIKE - This is something we really want to blow up. If you or anyone else has info on this activity that we can use, please get it to us. Send it to frank@thinkbigworksmall.com. We want to know what builders are feeding what lenders and what the incentives are. Thanks

Frank Garay: (November 03, 2009 6:51am)

Park City John - D'oh! Thanks. Our bad.

Grant: (November 03, 2009 6:50am)

Vote, this will only change with your vote..take note who is doing this to us and vote accordingly. Did you vote today if your state held elections for your voice to be heard?

GODLIKE: (November 03, 2009 6:50am)

All this talk about relationships of Remax, etc with the lenders and title companies comes back to a question I've asked several times with no answer here. A while back a law was put into place that a builder (and presumably other entities as well) cannot offer a better incentive to a buyer to use THEIR lender rather than the lender the buyer wants to use. It had a delayed implementation and I haven't heard when or if it was going into effect. Does anyone know?

DAG: (November 03, 2009 6:46am)

Cindylou - I've disputed one appraisal with SunTrust, the ridiculous appraiser came back with EXACTLY the same appraisal. Not even an extra note. I just had another where I provided 4 comps, (I was not disputing value) appraiser came back with even worse verbage. I've closed all the loans with SunTrust, some I needed to adjust loan amount, etc. None of these were due to the appraiser changing a thing on his report. Appraisers are even more insulated than before from reality. They can be stubborn and they are. Every issue I've had SunTrust has been on my side to no avail. I prepare my borrowers to not expect the appraisal process to be fair, accurate or easy. If it works out that is great, but don't count on it. LSI has been the worst of the AMC's, all appraisers the use are inept and delivery is nearly 3 weeks.

Bertram: (November 03, 2009 6:42am)

I've been a Realtor since 1974 and I'd been taught those kinds of referral fees have been illegal that whole time. How do I get in on that gravy train?

cindylou: (November 03, 2009 6:41am)

Old Timer-Thanks for the advise. It was HVCC, so if I do get 2 respectable appraisers to do this, will the lender look at them since it would not be an HVCC appraisal that I show them? This appraisal really is bad, I just don't know how to go about it to make this known.

Sparky: (November 03, 2009 6:33am)

Hey Dog'nthebroker, Are you saying you know EVERYTHING?? Admit it you don't. My point is is that Brokers are not going away, will not go away, and cannot go away. The simple reason is that I won't let it go away. Just a little FYI... There are private institutional monies that hate the current state of affairs and want to move away from Fannie and Freddie. There is tooooo much opportunity outside the traditional funding route for a common sense lending group to come in and set thier own rules. And guess what..more products, more selection,and more control to help your client. Let Barney try to make a name for himself. Take away his control and who cares what he does.

Lender: (November 03, 2009 6:27am)

Dog'n the broker....You are short sighted. I can't figure out why you would not want the broker around, it makes no sense. I also laughed when you said you had the inside scoop, that's as wrong as your blog views. You just have a bone to pick with brokers for some reason.

Old Timer: (November 03, 2009 6:24am)

cindylou - if you supply them with CONCRETE evidence to dispute it, they should look at it...but it is still their "judgement call". It would probably be costly because you will probably need at least 2 "respectable" appraisers to do the work, 1 to complete a "concise" full review of the bad appraisal with supporting documents and reasoning why it is bad, and another to supply a real appraisal....If you turn the "bad appraisal" into your state appraisal board, you can do us all a favor by taking out the "trash"...Good luck

cindylou: (November 03, 2009 6:15am)

Has anyone out there had any luck when disputing an appraisal with Sun Trust? I have a bad apppraisal, and it should be disputed, but have been told that it will do no good even if we show this appraisal was bad.

Common Sense: (November 03, 2009 6:15am)

This is astounding! First you guys complain about the government's involvement in our industry and then you praise the government for trying to limit someone else's compensation. The only ones who should have a say in their compensation is their employers, the shareholders. You can't have it both ways. You are either a big-government liberal or you're not. You want the government to be involved in the private sector or you don't. You can't say you want the government involved in someone else's business and not expect them to get involved in yours.

Park City John: (November 03, 2009 6:13am)

Madoff ran the NASDAQ, not the SEC. Very BIG difference there guys.

Nike 'em 'till they Glow: (November 03, 2009 5:59am)

Portfolio banks don't pay YSP 95% of the time so I basically broker them out to non-portfolio banks and although they hold the loans most of the time they still use Fannie and Freddie guidelines and they are running so scared they are a more of a PITA to deal with.

Screw The Big Ones: (November 03, 2009 5:50am)

Dog'nthebroker, plain and simple you're a TOOL, got it....now go back to your Banker hours and Holier than Thou attitude and Pound Sand....rant over, thanks.

Bugs Bunny: (November 03, 2009 5:40am)

"Elmer Fudd" has no Idea what he is doing. "Kill the Rabbit", kill the Rabbit; kill the Rabbit. Barney Frank is the perfect fall guy as the stooge, running around in circles, trying to get the media to grab some crazy story to divert attention, from their actions. Their actions are: Example: Giving free rain to the “Big Banks” who took the payoff so they will can ran all of the small banks and brokers out of business. Example: Making FHA easier so they can retain five years of free Mortgage Insurance income, the next move will be the Federal Governments push to create a fund from the income from these funds just like they did with Social Security! HVCC, no MI for Conventional Product over 85% available was created to divert all loans over to the FHA product; all in the name of recovery. I am the Rabbit, Barney! Stop it!

Old Timer: (November 03, 2009 5:39am)

ej... If the appraiser (aka Brother) is not disclosing the relationship within the appraisal report, they are violating USPAP (and I am sure the State Licensing board as well). That is a strict violation of the ethic section of USPAP and that appraiser will lose their license... So turn him in already and get the "trash" out of our industry.

Dog'nthebroker: (November 03, 2009 5:34am)

The big boys are swinging their bat. And guess who's the little ball? That's right. The broker. Your days are numbered. The inside scoop is that the powers are going to make the brokers environment soooo hard to thrive in that they will eventually go away. When the last few die hards are standing that's when the final blow will be delivered. YOUR DAYS are numbered. Face it. People who need loans won't need you. Companies like Quicken loans will gobble you up and eventually specialty big companies, (WAL MART) like institutions will take over. This isn't what's best but it's coming. Wake up and smell the coffee and position yourself for the inevitable. The biggest issue Washington has with the broker is that the broker IS NOT concerned about the consumers long term goals, financial well being or overall big picture. Since the only thing brokers care about is getting a commission check and getting the customer INTO A LOAN, Washington is raising the bar of conduct.

are you kidding: (November 03, 2009 5:16am)

Is anyone really suprised that "good ol" Barney Franks is doing this ???..... Just last week he was talking about how hard he was going to make it for the non "too big to fail" lenders...even saying he was going to unleash the "death squads"... Please, the writing is on the wall, Mr "I have too much cum in my mouth and can't speak properly" is doing EXACTLY what he wants, and that is to help out his "friends" to get rid of all the pesky little gnats that are just taking away from the big boy profits..... The ONLY way to stop the B.S. is to DON'T RE-ELECT ALL OF THE SCUMBAGS AND GET THEM OUT OF OFFICE!!!!! Then maybe we can get back to work...

Sniper: (November 03, 2009 4:51am)

We voted them in, so what are we complaining about? Since most of the poeple want everything for free and the govenerment to provide everything rather than working for it, we go it! When you vote incompetence into office, you get incompetence from government. My old addage still works... Take them out one at a time! By the way, did you vote today? I did my part how about you? Now is the time to start voting the incompentens out of office and start over! Let's clean house from the top down!

ej: (November 03, 2009 4:34am)

and...to get back on topic: why shouldn't a L. O. be compensated more for working with a client who does all things possible to queer a deal? Not using correct name (maiden name instead of married name which is on all i.d.), paying down an account to less than 10 payments (she read the HUD guidelines but not the part that says the payment must be less than $100), reducing student loans (again read the HUD guidelines) instead of putting them in deferrment, spending her money after providing bank statements showing it was in the bank (delays in closing due to above problems) caused the request for updated bank statements. Don't we deserve extra pay for the extra work involved in this type of Know It All client who does everything possible to create extra work? My clients who are squeaky clean get the best rates (par) and I get compensated (YSP) for the ones who are difficult. This is the difference between removing a wart and removing a major body part. HaHa. of sourse i deserve to

ej: (November 03, 2009 4:28am)

the real estate industry? Certainly the fault doesn't lie solely with the mortgage people. Why does the spotlight never shine on the realtors who insist on using "their" L. O., "their" appraiser", and their title company? Has anybody ever really dug deep enough to find the true "relationship" in some of these big real estate scams? I know just in my county a builder, his wife (a.ka. real estate broker), the mortgage broker (a.k.a. his brother-in-law) and the appraiser (a.k.a. his brother) are we seeing a trend here, were all invloved in higher appraised values, higher closing costs and higher interest rates. This led to buyers being "forced" to use the preferred service providers. Can we say "family tree with no branches" scenario?

ej: (November 03, 2009 4:24am)

Referral fees have always been a part of the real estate business. If you were big enough to pay them you got the business. How do you think the "too big to fail" boys got that big? My first 6 months in the mortgage business i had no fewer than 3 realtors offer to send me clients if i would pay THEM 50% of the origination fee! Interestingly enough they didn't offer to pay me 50% of their fee if i sent them a qualified buyer. I was smart enought to discuss this with my broker the very first time it was proposed and he set me perfectly straight on RESPA. Still the practice goes on. Why has nobody investigated the incestuous relationships between ReMax, Keller Williams (just to name a few) and the closing agents or the mortgage companies to whom they force refer their buyers? I have been at a closing where the realtor asked the attorney where her $500 fee was for sending the clsing to the attorney? He just amended the HUD and went on with the closing. Who are the real crooks in

Jersey Girl: (November 03, 2009 4:17am)

Frank TBWS: Hey cranky pants. ;) You are right...this world is so full of crap! No end in sight. Maybe you guys can bring back Mabel this week to cheer us up. Thanks-love your show!

Big Mac: (November 03, 2009 4:09am)

Good show! Good Point! NAMB's recent webinar explains the thinking of regulators on indirect compensation and YSP. Look guys, the G-men want to eliminate the possibility that less informed, consumers on the lower rungs of the economic food chain get scewered by "opportunistic" LOs. Easy fix folks, each company (not the government) set rates and terms for all originations eliminating those possibilities. We get to police ourselves or be policed. Regulators have for years disliked and tried to eliminate disparate pricing. Everything old is new again, this time with teeth. Lets find out what they want and give it to them in a win win way. Love the show, gets me going in the AM. Keep up the good work!!

Ex full time Realtor in Florida: (November 03, 2009 4:02am)

Don't you wish there was someone making the laws that has actual working experience in the mortgage field??? We have been watching the same thing in the short sale end of things. If they had only put some rules in place when they gave the banks all that money we would be seeing more movement in the real estate market. We watch the short sale deals fall apart because the buyers lose patience then the banks dump the properties when they finally forclose, further lowering property values!! You just feel like nobody in the government really understands what is happening on the street!!

rocksteadyredhead: (November 03, 2009 3:54am)

I can see realtors being hauled before their state's Real Estate Commission for these "referral fees." No referral fee is worth the public humiliation of having your name published in the REC newsletter's rap sheet, not to mention the fines imposed and the possibility of having your license suspended. Just don't go there.